Rosh Hashana 2:8 — Two Testimonies, Accepted and Contested
The Lived Mishnah·A Zeman Nakat Project
Audio · Listen with Ephraim Diamond
Listen with Ephraim Diamond · 6:46
0:00 / 6:46
0:00
6:46
Speed
MoedSederסדרמוֹעֵד
Rosh HashanaMesechtaמסכתראש השנה
2Perekפרקב׳
8Mishnahמשנהח׳
Mishnah ראש השנה ב׳:ח׳ · Rosh Hashana 2:8
דְּמוּת צוּרוֹת לְבָנוֹת הָיוּ לוֹ לְרַבָּן גַּמְלִיאֵל בַּטַּבְלָא וּבַכֹּתֶל בַּעֲלִיָּתוֹ,
שֶׁבָּהֶן מַרְאֶה אֶת הַהֶדְיוֹטוֹת וְאוֹמֵר, הֲכָזֶה רָאִיתָ אוֹ כָזֶה.
מַעֲשֶׂה שֶׁבָּאוּ שְׁנַיִם וְאָמְרוּ, רְאִינוּהוּ שַׁחֲרִית בַּמִּזְרָח וְעַרְבִית בַּמַּעֲרָב.
אָמַר רַבִּי יוֹחָנָן בֶּן נוּרִי, עֵדֵי שֶׁקֶר הֵם.
כְּשֶׁבָּאוּ לְיַבְנֶה קִבְּלָן רַבָּן גַּמְלִיאֵל.
וְעוֹד בָּאוּ שְׁנַיִם וְאָמְרוּ, רְאִינוּהוּ בִזְמַנּוֹ, וּבְלֵיל עִבּוּרוֹ לֹא נִרְאָה,
וְקִבְּלָן רַבָּן גַּמְלִיאֵל.
אָמַר רַבִּי דוֹסָא בֶּן הַרְכִּינָס, עֵדֵי שֶׁקֶר הֵן,
הֵיאָךְ מְעִידִין עַל הָאִשָּׁה שֶׁיָּלְדָה, וּלְמָחָר כְּרֵסָהּ בֵּין שִׁנֶּיהָ.
אָמַר לוֹ רַבִּי יְהוֹשֻׁעַ,
רוֹאֶה אֲנִי אֶת דְּבָרֶיךָ:
Diagrams of the shapes of the moon were kept by Rabban Gamliel on a tablet and on the wall of his upper chamber,
with which he would show the laymen and say: Was it like this that you saw, or like this?
There was a case where two came and said: We saw it in the morning in the east and in the evening in the west.
Said R' Yochanan ben Nuri: They are false witnesses.
When they came to Yavne, they were accepted by Rabban Gamliel.
And again two came and said: We saw it at its proper time, but on the night of the added day it was not seen —
and they were accepted by Rabban Gamliel.
Said R' Dosa ben Harkinas: They are false witnesses.
How can they testify about a woman that she has given birth, when the next day her belly is between her teeth?
Said to him R' Yehoshua:
I see your words.
A reading aid, not an exact translation.
This English is a clause-by-clause rendering to help you follow the Hebrew. It is not word-for-word literal, and it is not a transcript of the recorded shiur — the audio carries explanation and context the translation deliberately leaves out.
case/objectrestrictive rulingpermissive rulingTannareason
Structure
The shape of it▾
Summary Chart
Two Testimonies, Accepted and Contested▾
| Case | Ruling | Reason |
|---|---|---|
| The witnesses are laymen who cannot describe what they saw — how did Rabban Gamliel get it out of them? | He showed them diagrams of the moon's shapes on a tablet and on his wall | — |
| Two men say they saw it at dawn in the east and again at dusk in the west — can that be? | R' Yochanan ben Nuri: False witnesses | — |
| Rabban Gamliel: Accepted | — | |
| Two men say they saw it on the thirtieth night and not on the thirty-first — do you believe them? | Rabban Gamliel: Accepted | — |
| R' Dosa ben Harkinas: False witnesses | a woman does not give birth and still carry her belly the next day | |
| R' Yehoshua: I see your words | — |
Transcript
A machine transcript of the recorded shiur.
This is the shiur as spoken, transcribed automatically and left unedited — the wording is Ephraim's, and occasional transcription errors remain. It follows the audio word by word.
Transcript · click any word to jump
▾